Episode 504 - Toys To Death

Discussion in 'The Podcasts' started by Torgo, Dec 13, 2016.

  1. Torgo

    Torgo Grand Poobah Staff Member


    Full Show Notes

    New release. Elite Dangerous finally coming to PS4. Old Time Hockey announced for PS4. PS4 sales surpass 50 million. Playing & watching. Review: PS4 Pro. Emails. Comedian is Eugene Mirman

    8:50 - Elite Dangerous
    12:48 - Old Time Hockey
    16:35 - Farming Simulator 17
    35:12 - Pinball FX2 VR
    41:02 - Eve Valkyrie
    Break music from Garou-Mark of the Wolves
    1:07:05 - PlayStation 4 Pro
    1:45:48 - Skylanders
    xbottlediggerx likes this.
  2. Brad Custer

    Brad Custer Well-Known Member

    Glad to see this one is up. Its all prepped for my drive home. Sadly, these days, a podcast of 2 hours barely covers my commute home. Gotta love DC. ;)
    Torgo likes this.
  3. andyscout

    andyscout PSN: andyscout Staff Member

    When the post went up, I spent far too long studying the banner image, trying to figure out "the joke" and figuring I was missing something. Glad the end of the podcast cleared that all up.
  4. Josh

    Josh Co-Host of PS Nation

    lol, so I did the outer box and left a completely empty "circle" opening that Mason filled in at the end of the podcast. He took his time some more as he moved to the interior.
  5. I'm looking at the recent numbers (I'm a shareholder). 4K BD adoption rate is lower than HD-DVD from both the customer and publishing movie houses. We all know what happened to that format. Regular BD is lower than DVD in its year to year ratio due to increase streaming options. This may change in 3 years (highly unlikely) but more 4K content will be consumed through streaming than physical media.
  6. andyscout

    andyscout PSN: andyscout Staff Member

    True, but it still seems like a shitty move for those of us who do like physical media. I don't have a 4K TV yet but if I did, I'd probably want to get 4K blurays for it and then I'd need another device. Which as Glenn pointed out, XBox One S is one of the cheaper 4K bluray devices on the market, meaning Sony is essentially convincing me to buy their competitor.
    Renegade Bastard likes this.
  7. Beram

    Beram Member

    @Torgo at the beginning of the podcast you made mention of how bad the traffic was Friday of PSX. My driver that day said it was due to being first Friday of December in which Disneyland was having their Christmas lighting festivities kick-off which draws a massive crowd.
  8. I like physical too, due to Comcast data caps! As part of an investment it doesn't make economical sense to keep printing disc in the long run that isn't going to increase profit margins. My desire for physical works against the portfolio in the long term.
  9. I fully back Glenn's review score of the PS4 Pro. From all the research I've done on the console as well as the countless hours I've spent watching YouTube videos about the console, from what I've gathered... I was thinking the console was about a 7/10 as well. I also think the console was kinda half-assed, too. I don't own a 4K TV, so I definitely have no plans to buy one. Even if my current launch model PS4 does break? I'll just replace it with the Slim PS4.

    I really hope Microsoft can deliver better with Scorpio next year. So far they haven't let me down with Xbox One S. I gave that system a 9/10 in my own personal review. (Tied with launch model PS4. That system also received a 9/10 review score from me.) I highly recommend the XB1S to anyone that asks if they should buy it over the standard shit model, VCR looking Xbox One that Don Mattrick revealed! I gave that console a 5/10 review score. It's pure trash and ridiculous. I feel sorry for people that bought that hunk of junk. :(
  10. andyscout

    andyscout PSN: andyscout Staff Member

    Hmm, so lemme get this straight.
    Xbone - 5/10
    XboneS - 9/10

    PS4 - 9/10
    PS4Pro - 7/10

    So overclocking the system gets 4 points but actually putting in more power looses 2? :D
    I mean, joking aside, the Pro is exactly a PS4 but with a little more power under the hood. Everything you like about the base PS4 is there on the Pro. Just with a few enhancements.

    I got my PS4 Pro in the other day (though I didn't buy it, got it free using rewards points). I haven't had a whole lot of time to try out any Pro enhanced games but I have played some FFXV with it. It's not terribly noticeable but I'm also running on the low settings. Supposedly the high settings in FFXV have more issues. Once they fix that, I'll try it out.

    I don't have a 4K TV (though I would like to get one eventually) but I do have a PSVR which was one of my main reasons for wanting a Pro. Overall, it's hard to feel like there's anything new and "amazing" about the Pro over my base PS4 but knowing I'll get some upgrades here and there in some games is nice. And I'd definitely agree that I'd say "why not" to getting a Pro over a Slim to anyone buying a new PS4 (or replacing a broken one). I mean, unless you're absolutely, positively sure you're not going to get a PSVR or 4K TV for the next three or four years and you reeeaaaally need that extra ~$100, there's no reason not to future-proof yourself. Pro does everything a normal PS4 does, but better so might as well.

    TBH though, just having that extra USB port might be worth the upgrade. :p
  11. The Xbox One S scored substantially higher in my review vs original Xbox One for ALL of the upgrades AND downgrades it brought to the table. 4K-UHD Blu-ray, addition of HDR support, faster silicon under the hood, faster storage solution under the hood, smaller sleek and sexy form factor, intergration of the power supply with an internal solution, removal of the Kinect port, ability to work in vertical orientation, etc etc.

    The Xbox One S is a substantial improvement over the VCR Xbox One. That's where the console picked up 4 more points. :)

    I know the PS4 Pro is just a PS4, but what costs it points on my review score is the fact Sony keeps calling it a 4K gaming console, when in actuality it's a faux K gaming console. The fact that Sony did not include the 4K-UHD Blu-ray drive that their competition has. The console is actually larger and heavier than launch model PS4. HDCP handshake issues with many 4K televisions just yielding a black screen when trying to use the Pro in 4K resolution. Performance improvements to games are still hit and miss or non-existent, based on the Dev's skill and willingness to program and patch correctly. (See Digital Foundry videos as examples) Hell, Microsoft didn't have that problem with the Xbox One S at all. ALL Xbox One games play as good on the S model as they do on the VCR model or better! NONE of the games play worse on the S model, including 360 backwards compatibility titles. That's without no games even needing to be patched to take advantage of the S model, either. Quite a few issues have come up with games where the Pro mode enabled games played worse than they would play on base mode.

    I think that the PS4 Pro was totally unwarranted and rushed out to market too soon as well. Not to mention commanding a $400 USD price tag when the system still feels undercooked. The issues with the PS4 Pro is why it's score dove a couple points vs the original launch model PS4 in my personal opinion and review.
  12. andyscout

    andyscout PSN: andyscout Staff Member

    But the Pro DOES support true 4K for some games. And the ones that are "faux K" are because they're too processor intensive for a FOUR HUNDRED DOLLAR box to render at 4K. Considering that it takes thousands of dollars to get truly 4K gaming on a PC, the fact that you can get most of the way there on a $400 (or less, as I've already been seeing Pros marked down $40-$50) box is pretty incredible. The scaling that Pro does is, as I understand from Digital Foundry, actually pretty impressive. Sure, it's not true 4K, but it seems to be a pretty good stop-gap.

    The S model is also "faux K" despite the fact that Microshaft has been touting it as a 4K console. And unlike Pro, I don't think they have any games that support true 4K. You do get a boost on some XBO games on the S, but c'mon, you're talking shit like 44 fps vs 47 fps. Is that really worth writing home about? Given that the PS4 ran most games better than the old Xbone, the S is pretty much just bringing it back up to the same level as the base PS4.

    On the performance side, it's true that there are a very few that have minor issues, but a) it is a very few and b) most, if not all, of those games have options in the menus that let you tailor the experience. For example, FFXV has slightly worse frame pacing when running in the higher end mode on Pro. But you can run it in the lower mode and get just as good, if not better, performance as running the game on a base PS4. And the story is similar for games like Uncharted 4, where the game has slight performance drops if you push the game into the graphics heavy side. I have a feeling that these kinds of things will get patched going forward (I think SE said they're working on a patch already) plus I imagine future pro enhanced games will try to avoid these kinds of things. If anything, I think the games/patches were rushed to market, rather than the console itself. (Which we've already seen games getting released too soon as a big issue in the industry). Plus, again, we're talking about shit like the base FPS being like 50 fps and the high graphics version on Pro being like 45 fps. Hardly a huge issue, if you do choose to play the game in the higher graphics mode.

    I haven't yet had any HDCP issues with my Pro, fortunately. Though I actually have had HDCP issues with my PS3 and with my base PS4, so I kinda expect it at some point. Again, I think the issue is less with Pro and more with how fucktarded HDCP is. Basically, fuck HDCP and fuck the movie industry for forcing it on us.

    I'm not saying Pro is perfect, and I basically agree that it wasn't needed. But I think you're significantly overplaying some of these things.
  13. Playa! I understand your frustrations and believe me... I'm frustrated, too. As a PlayStation fan, myself, it was very hard to take off my rose tinted glasses and give this console a fair evaluation. I completely agree with what Glenn said in his review about the console, plus a few additions here or there that he didn't mention. Giving the PS4 Pro a 7/10 review score was difficult and broke my heart, but I had to put my fanboy biases aside and do it for the greater good of gamers out there. I really wish the Pro was a 9.0 like the launch model PS4 was, but I gave the Pro as fair of an assessment as I could, based on all facts presented to me. 7.0 is what I came up with on my own.

    Hopefully Sony can clean their game up with PS4 Pro Slim and maybe next time around, they will earn that 9.0 or higher score.

    In the meantime, I am still very happy with my launch model PS4 accessory console addon for my PS Vita! :)
  14. Farmerjohn_

    Farmerjohn_ Member

    I saw the toy r us sales over black Friday buy 1 get 2 free. But the cost of one was 3x the norm. Especially on Disney infinity ($15) which is $5 everywhere. Maybe it was just my store, but the sale was basically not a sale. I saw the same on Lego and Skylanders. A quick Google search of the product showed the lower price on Amazon and Walmart. I asked if they would price match and they said not on the buy 1 get 2.
  15. Torgo

    Torgo Grand Poobah Staff Member

    The Pro is NOT half-assed. The biggest issue is that it targets a very small demographic at the moment. Next year it may be an '8' or even higher, seriously. It's very solid hardware except for the missing UHD drive.
    Renegade Bastard likes this.
  16. Fair enough and valid point, but then the hardware would have to be re-reviewed in a year from now.

    Reviewing a product within days or weeks after it's release to market is fair game in my book. Whatever score it gets? It's more than likely what the product deserved. You only get one chance to make a great first impression, if you drop the ball? Well shame on you! The product shouldn't have been released so soon if it wasn't ready.

    That goes for anything that's being reviewed. Not just video games and video game hardware.

    I'm a Glock fanboy, but I've given some of Glock's more recent handguns lower scores than the 9.5/10 I gave to my 3rd Gen Glock 17 9mm. I'm talking 7's and 8's. I may be a fanboy, but I know how to set my biases aside when reviewing a product. :)
  17. Torgo

    Torgo Grand Poobah Staff Member

    The hardware IS ready, but there's a lack of direction with developers (which always happens with new hardware), and the biggest issue is that the display tech itself is still in its infancy. The PS4 Pro hardware is actually quite impressive, especially for the cost.
  18. John B. aka Johni3w6

    John B. aka Johni3w6 Active Member

    I'm happy with my PS4 Pro so far, was in the camp of it being my first PS4, kind of glad I held out and waited.
    Was going to spring for a PS4 as talk of the "Neo" aka PS4 started to spill out and decided to wait. For once I'm happy that I could finally buy a console, month after release and be ahead of the curve instead of buying a console 4-5 years into it's life cycle.
  19. Brad Custer

    Brad Custer Well-Known Member

    I'm happy with my PS4 Pro and I traded in my launch day PS4 for it. Even if I don't have the TV to take full advantage of the hardware yet. I was going to get a new PS4 anyway and this happen to come along at the perfect time for me.

    Torgo and John B. aka Johni3w6 like this.